[Novalug] [Ma-linux] Fedora 13 Install

James Ewing Cottrell 3rd JECottrell3@Comcast.NET
Tue Jul 20 12:25:11 EDT 2010


On 7/19/2010 8:26 PM, Maxwell Spangler wrote:
> On Mon, 2010-07-19 at 16:16 -0400, Mackenzie Morgan wrote:
>    
>> On Mon, Jul 19, 2010 at 3:47 PM, James Ewing Cottrell 3rd
>> <JECottrell3@comcast.net>  wrote:
>>      
>>> Who cares? Yum is 'mostly equivalent' to apt-get. Both take 'install',
>>> 'remove', and 'update'. I can't remember if apr-get does 'search', or
>>> whether you need another command for that.
>>>
>>> Just learn yum, or at least the basic subset.
>>>        
>    
>> How is that in ANY way useful?  You're telling a Debian user to use yum?  No.
>>      
> I'm a believer that one should respect the native tools and features of
> a given hardware or software system and try to get as much benefit out
> of them as possible.
>
> If they're broken or inferior, then work around them, but most of the
> time your work will produce higher quality results if you engage native
> tools and use them as they were designed for that integrated system.
> Being different from what you know is your problem and not the tool's
> problem.
>
> Also, using native tools lets you work in a team environment without
> creating a mess and pissing off other maintainers.  Fedora&  Redhat
> users want to see rpm and yum.  Debian&  Ubuntu users want to see
> apt-get.   Life is good like that.
>
> A skilled administrator learns both and rushes to put them on their
> resume for feed the buzzword scanning machines.
>    
Thank you Max, for Clearly Stating what I meant to say. I have seen 
attempts to emulate apt-get on RPM based systems, and the results have 
been somewhat disappointing. The message I was ALSO trying to get across 
was that since apt-get and yum are So Similar that it is essentially 
useless to attempt to simulate one on the other system unless you had a 
program that depended on a specific syntax.

There is also some confusion as to the context. I was telling a Fedora 
user to use yum, not depend on an apt-get clone. I would advise the 
Debianite to use apt-get rather than a port of yum.

One minor note I haven't mentioned yet is why is the search function 
placed in apt-cache? And why isn't it included in the apt-get package? 
Apt seems to have all these little silly side-programs that aren't 
really coordinated very well. ISTR that most packages that start with 
apt- aren't very good or have limited use. Feel free to point out any 
useful exceptions.

Now to contradict you a bit, I have worked in many UNIX shops where the 
basic tools were inferior to the GNU ones, and the best strategy was to 
compile as many as possible and put /usr/local/bin first in $PATH. I 
wouldn't call "failure to add truly useful options" equivalent to 
"designed for that integrated system" in the case of the Core Utilities. 
It's just Vendor Laziness.

Finally, your last comment is pure Truth on Wry.

JIM

P.S. FWIW, I still like and use dselect. Aptitude is kind of cool too, 
but it's not quite clear how to use its resolution commands.



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